YCQM: October 20, 2019

BURLINGTON, Vt. (WCAX) GOOD MORNING, EVERYONE, I'M DARREN PERRON.
RIGHT NOW ON "YOU CAN QUOTE ME," BERNIE SANDERS RETURNS TO THE DEBATE STAGE AFTER HIS HEART ATTACK.
AND PICKS UP A COUPLE OF BIG ENDORSEMENTS.
I'LL TALK TO A POLITICAL SCIENTIST ABOUT WHAT THIS MEANS FOR HIS CAMPAIGN, ALSO A PILOT'S PERSPECTIVE, CLOSE CALLS, FEARS OF FLYING, AND RUINED RELATIONSHIPS ALL ABOARD A PLANE.
HE DISCUSSES HIS NEW BOOK, "WE HAVE NO CRASH POLICY." AND WE TALK TO THE JOURNALIST WHO TOOK DOWN HARVEY WEINSTEIN AND INSPIRED THE ME TOO MOVEMENT.
AND THAT'S WHERE WE BEGIN THIS MORNING.
TWO PULITZER PRIZE WINNING JOURNALISTS WERE IN VERMONT PROMOTING THEIR BOOK.
JODI KANTOR AND MEGAN TWOHEY BROKE THE STORY ABOUT HARVEY WEINSTEIN'S SEXUAL ABUSE ALLEGATIONS, LEADING TO THE ME TOO MOVEMENT.
THEIR NEW BOOK, SHE SAID, DETAILS THE BEHIND THE SCENES PROCESS OF INVESTIGATING THE ALLEGATIONS AGAINST WEINSTEIN AND UNCOVERING THE SECRECY THAT HE BOUGHT FROM MANY ALLEGED VICTIMS.
CAT VIGLIENZONI SAT DOWN WITH THEM TO HEAR HOW IT HAPPENED.
>> SO HOW LONG DID IT TAKE YOU TO DO THIS INVESTIGATION?
>> IT TOOK MONTHS AND MONTHS AND IT INVOLVED A COMMITMENT AT THE "NEW YORK TIMES" THAT WENT ALL THE WAY TO THE TOP.
THERE WAS ANOTHER JOURNALIST WHO HAD TRIED TO REPORT THIS STORY ONLY TO GET STUCK.
AND WE CAN UNDERSTAND WHY.
WE WEREN'T JUST RUNNING UP AGAINST THE SECRECY THAT HAD CLOAKED HOLLYWOOD AND KEPT ALL THESE ALLEGATIONS HIDDEN, WE WERE ALSO RUNNING UP AGAINST THINGS LIKE SECRET SETTLEMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN USED TO SILENCE WOMEN.
THERE WAS A CASE OF A WOMAN WHO HAD BEEN ALLEGEDLY SEXUALLY ASSAULTED BY WINE SEEN IN 1990 WHEN SHE WAS A YOUNG ASSISTANT IN ONE OF HIS FIRST COMPANIES AND WHEN I TRACKED HER DOWN OUTSIDE NEW YORK, AND KNOCKED ON HER DOOR, SHE SAID I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR SOMEBODY TO KNOCK ON MY DOOR FOR 25 YEARS, BUT BECAUSE OF THE SECRET SETTLEMENT SHE WAS LEGALLY PROHIBITED FROM SAYING WHAT HAD HAPPENED TO HER.
>> SO HOW DID YOU GET PAST THOSE BARRIERS THAT OTHER REPORTERS HAD GOTTEN STUCK ON IN THE PAST?
>> THE "NEW YORK TIMES" MADE THIS COMMITMENT TO SEXUAL HARASSMENT REPORTING AND THIS WAS ACROSS INDUSTRIES.
WE WERE LOOKING BOO SILICON VALLEY, RESTAURANTS, FACTORIES.
AND OUR COLLEAGUES, EMILY STEELE AND MICHAEL SCHMITT HAD DONE THE STORY OF BILL O'REILLY, AND I KNOW IT FEELS LIKE 100 SEXUAL HARASSMENT STORIES AGO, BUT IT WAS A GAME CHANGER, BECAUSE FIRST OF ALL HE WAS FIRED FROM THE JOB BECAUSE OF THE AIRING OF THESE ALLEGATIONS WHICH WAS SHOCKING AT THE TIME.
BUT ALSO TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION THEY FIGURED OUT HOW TO REVERSE ENGINEER THE SECRET SETTLEMENTS THAT O'REILLY HAD PAID TO WOMEN.
IN THE PAST THOSE KINDS OF SETTLEMENTS, ESSENTIALLY AGREEMENTS NOT TO TALK, HAD BEEN A REASON THE STORY COULDN'T BE REPORTED.
EMILY AND MIKE FIGURED OUT THAT THEY WERE THE STORY IN A WAY BECAUSE THEY FORMED A KIND OF LEGAL AND FINANCIAL TRAIL THAT COULD BE FOLLOWED.
SO THERE WERE CASES IN WHICH THE COME COULDN'T TALK OR GO ON THE RECORD, BUT WE COULD STILL WRITE ABOUT IN A MORE GENERAL WAY WHAT APPEARED TO HAVE HAPPENED.
>> SO AS YOU WERE GOING TRUE THE INVESTIGATION AND TALKING TO PEOPLE OFF THE RECORD, HOW DID YOU GET THAT ON THE RECORD PERSON THAT YOU NEEDED?
>> THAT'S ANOTHER THING THAT'S REALLY EXCITING ABOUT THIS BOOK IS THAT WE'RE ABLE TO TELL THE BACK STORIES OF SOME OF THESE BRAVE WOMEN WHO DID GO ON THE RECORD FOR THE FIRST TIME.
>> WHEN THE STORY GOT PUBLISHED WERE YOU WORRIED IT WOULD GET SWEPT UNDER THE RUG?
>> IN FACT, THERE WAS A NIGHT, MAYBE TWO OR THREE NIGHTS BEFORE PUBLICATION WHEN WE WERE TAKING A TAXI RIDE HOME, WE WERE LIVING A FEW BLOCKS AWAY FROM EACH OTHER IN NEW YORK CITY AND HAD BEEN SO FOCUSED ON GETTING EVERY WORD OF THE STORY RIGHT THAT WE SAT BACK IN THE CAB AND SAID IS ANYBODY GOING TO READ THIS, IS ANYBODY GOING TO CARE?
BECAUSE MANY HOLLYWOOD SOURCES HAD BEEN TELLING US, HEY, THE CASTING COUCH IS PART OF HOLLYWOOD, THIS HAPPENS ALL THE TIME, IT'S AN OPEN SECRET, YOU'RE NEVER GOING TO GET THE STORY AND EVEN IF YOU DO NOTHING WILL EVER CHANGE.
>> SO WHEN IT DID END UP, YOU KNOW, GETTING THIS KIND OF HIGH PROFILE ATTENTION, WAS THAT SURPRISING FOR YOU?
>> IT WAS SURPRISING.
AND LISTEN, WE FELT THAT ALMOST IMMEDIATELY.
WE HAD SPENT MONTHS AND ACTUALLY OUR WORK ON THIS ISSUE EXTENDS BEYOND THE HARVEY WEINSTEIN INVESTIGATION.
WE SPENT YEARS AND YEARS TRYING TO GET WOMEN TO OPEN UP ABOUT THESE STORIES AND GO PUBLIC WITH THEM.
AND WITHIN DAYS OF BREAKING THAT INITIAL WEINSTEIN STORY OUR EMAILS AND PHONES WERE FLOODED WITH WOMEN COMING TO US WITH A STORY OF SEXUAL HARASSMENT AND SEXUAL ABUSE.
IT BECAME LIKE A GROUP PROJECT ACROSS JOURNALISM, NOT JUST AT THE "NEW YORK TIMES," BUT BEYOND.
AND THERE WAS ONE MOMENT A COUPLE WEEKS AFTER THE STORY BROKE WHEN I WENT HOME AND WE HAD BEEN WORKING AROUND THE CLOCK AND I FLIPPED OPEN MY LAPTOP AND CLICKED ON FACEBOOK AND IT WAS THE FIRST TIME I SAW MY FRIENDS, FAMILY MEMBERS, OLD COLLEAGUES, USING THAT HASH TAG ME TOO TO TELL THEIR OWN STORIES, AND IT BROUGHT TEARS TO MY EYES.
>> WERE YOU GUYS WORRIED AT ALL FOR YOURSELVES, YOUR FAMILIES AS YOU WERE DOING THIS INVESTIGATION INTO A VERY POWERFUL PERSON?
>> THE SHORT ANSWER IS NO, WE WERE NOT WORRIED FOR OURSELVES.
OUR TOP EDITOR BROUGHT US INTO HIS OFFICE EARLY ON IN THE INVESTIGATION AND SAID ASSUME YOU'RE BEING TRAILED BY PRIVATE INVESTIGATORS, TALK LIKE EVERY CONVERSATION IS BEING RECORDED.
WE WEREN'T THAT SURPRISED WHEN THESE HIGH PROFILE LAWYERS SHOWED UP BY WEINSTEIN'S SIDE AND THREATENED LAWSUITS AGAINST THE PAPER IF WE MOVED FORWARD WITH THIS REPORTING.
BUT WE WERE SCARED FOR OUR SOURCES AND WE WERE ALSO SCARED THAT WE WOULD BASICALLY HAVE LEARNED ALL THIS INFORMATION AND SOMEHOW NOT BE ABLE TO PUBLISH IT, THAT WE'D GO TO OUR GRAVES HAVING GOTTEN A GLIMPSE OF AN ALLEGED PREDATOR AND NOT BEEN ABLE TO PUBLISH THE TRUTH ABOUT HIM.
SO THOSE ARE THE QUESTIONS THAT KEPT US UP LATE AT NIGHT.
>> THE ME TOO MOVEMENT THAT CAME OUT OF THIS, WERE YOU SURPRISED AT THAT?
>> I THINK WE WERE VERY SURPRISED.
I THINK WE'VE ALL BEEN SURPRISED AT SO MANY ASTONISHING THINGS HAVE HAPPENED OVER THE LAST TWO YEARS SINCE WE PUBLISHED THE STORY.
I THINK WITH MEN LIKE CHARLIE ROSE AND MATT LAUER AND MARIO BATTALI WE TOOK THEIR POWER FOR GRANTED, IT SEEMED FIXED.
THE WAVE OF MASS FIRINGS, THE KIND OF REASSESSMENT OF A LOT OF LONG HELD ASSUMPTIONS, AND JUST THIS FEELING THAT EVEN THOSE OF US WHO KNOW A LOT ABOUT GENDER, IT TURNS OUT WE DIDN'T KNOW THE HALF OF WHAT AMERICAN WOMEN HAD FACED IN THE WORKPLACE AND BEYOND.
WE REMEMBER THE EARLY DAYS IN 2017 WHEN PEOPLE SAID OH, YOU KNOW, THIS IS GOING TO BURN OUT, IT'S GOING TO BE A SHORT-LIVED THING, HERE WE ARE IN 2019 EVERYBODY IS STILL DIGGING INTO THE JEFFREY EPSTEIN STORY, PLACE I DO DOMINGO HAD TO STEP AWAY FROM THE OPERA RECENTLY BECAUSE OF AGENCIESES.
AND EVERYBODY IS STILL STILL FIGURING OUT HOW TO DEAL WITH THIS IN OUR OFFICES, WORKPLACES, SCHOOLS.
SO EVEN AS WE STAND IN THE MIDDLE OF IT, WE CONTINUE TO BE SURVIVED BY IT.
>> FOR THE BOOK TOUR YOU GUYS ARE ON NOW, OBVIOUSLY THIS HAS BEEN A PROJECT LONG IN THE MAKING, YOU SAID ONE AND A HALF YEARS?
>> MAYBE TWO.
>> WE HOPE PEOPLE WHO READ THE BOOK TAKE AWAY?
>> WE WITNESSED EVENTS DIRECTLY FIRSTHAND AND THE BOOK IS AN OPPORTUNITY TO BRING PEOPLE WITH US.
THE EVENTS OF ME TOO HAVE COME TO MEAN SO MUCH TO SO MANY PEOPLE.
AND WHAT WE WANT TO SEE WITH THIS BOOK IS COME SIT WITH US ON THIS FIRST PHONE CONSIDERATIONS WITH ACTRESSES, COME MEET THE --
HARVEY WEINSTEIN'S ACCOUNT AMOUNT FOR 30 YEARS.
COME SIT WITH US IN THE OFFICES OF THE "NEW YORK TIMES" AS WE HAVE THIS KIND OF FINAL CONFRONTATION WITH HARVEY WEINSTEIN.
AND WE WANT PEOPLE TO FEEL THAT THEY ARE A PART OF THESE EVENTS AND THEY BELONG TO EVERYBODY.
>> DARREN: YOU CAN SEE MORE OF OUR CONVERSATIONS WITH THEM WHERE WE DISCUSS THE ME TOO MOVEMENT AND THE QUESTIONS THEY THINK SOCIETY HAS TO ANSWER TO MOVE FORWARD, ON OUR WEBSITE, WCAX.COM.
>>> UP NEXT, BERNIE SANDERS USES THE LATEST DEBATE AS A COMEBACK FROM HIS HEART ATTACK.
DID IT WORK?
AND LATER, THE HIGHS AND LOWS OF A PILOT'S LIFE.
YOU'RE WATCHING CHANNEL 3'S "YOU CAN QUOTE ME."
WE'RE BACK IN A MOMENT.
>> DARREN: BERNIE'S BACK.
THE FINGER WAGGING FEISTY PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE TRIED TO SHOW THE NATION IN THE LARGEST PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE IN U.S. HISTORY HE'S STILL READY TO FIGHT FOR THE NOMINATION.
>> TRUMP IS THE MOST CORRUPT PRESIDENT IN THE HISTORY OF THIS COUNTRY.
>> DARREN: BERNIE SANDERS DIDN'T LOOK LIKE A GUY WHO JUST HAD A HEART ATTACK.
INSTEAD LAUNCHING ENERGETIC ATTACKS AGAINST PRESIDENT TRUMP.
>> THIS IS A PRESIDENT WHO IS ENRICHING HIMSELF WHILE USING THE OVAL OFFICE TO DO THAT, AND THAT IS OUTRAGEOUS.
>> DARREN: SANDERS LARGELY DODGED A QUESTION ABOUT HIS HEALTH SCARE, SIMPLY SAYING HE'S HEALTHY AND FEELS GREAT.
HE THANKED HIS SUPPORTERS AND FELLOW CANDIDATES ON THE STAGE FOR THEIR WELL WISHES.
>> I JUST WANT TO THANK YOU FROM THE BOTTOM OF MY HEART, AND I'M SO HAPPY TO BE BACK WITH YOU THIS EVENING.
>> DARREN: SANDERS PROMISED A VIGOROUS UPCOMING CAMPAIGN SCHEDULE AS A WAY TO PROVE HE'S FIT TO RUN THE COUNTRY.
>> YOU HAVE TO INSPIRE PEOPLE, YOU HAVE TO EXCITE PEOPLE, YOU'VE GOT TO BRING WORKING PEOPLE AND YOUNG PEOPLE AND POOR PEOPLE INTO THE POLITICAL PROCESS.
>> DARREN: HE TOOK A JAB AT ONE OF THE FRONTRUNNERS, JOE BIDEN, AS THE FORMER VICE PRESIDENT LISTED OFF WHAT HE'S ACCOMPLISHED.
>> YOU GOT THE DISASTROUS WAR IN IRAQ DONE.
>> DARREN: SOURCES SAY SANDERS' CAMPAIGN TEAM HAS URGED HIM TO GET TOUGHER ON BIDEN.
AND THE OTHER FRONTRUNNER, ELIZABETH WARREN, WHO SUPPORTS SANDERS' MEDICARE FOR ALL PLAN.
SHE DODGED QUESTIONS ABOUT MIDDLE CLASS TAX HIKES TO PAY FOR IT.
SANDERS DIDN'T.
>> AT THE END OF THE DAY THE OVERWHELMING JORMT --
MAJORITY OF PEOPLE WILL SAVE MONEY ON THEIR HEALTH CARE BILLS.
BUT I DO THINK IT IS APPROPRIATE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT TAXES WILL GO UP.
THE TAX INCREASE THEY PAY WILL BE SUBSTANTIALLY LESS, SUBSTANTIALLY LESS THAN WHAT THEY WERE PAYING FOR PREMIUMS AND OUT OF POCKET EXPENSES.
>> DARREN: THE CANDIDATES ALSO DIFFERED ON HOW TO IMPROVE THE NATION'S JOBS PICTURE.
>> WE COULD PUT 15 MILLION PEOPLE TO WORK REBUILDING OUR ROADS, OUR BRIDGES, OUR WATER SYSTEMS.
>> DARREN: AND THE NIGHT ENDED WITH BIG NEWS FOR SENATOR SANDERS, AS HE EARNED ENDORSEMENTS FROM WELL-KNOWN CONGRESS WOMEN.
RASHIDA TLAIB OF MICHIGAN, ILAN OMAR AND EAKS DRY AOCASIO CORTEZ.
I ASKED ABOUT THE TOP TAKE AWAYS FROM THE DEBATE.
>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.
>> DARREN: LET'S TALK ABOUT THE ENDORSEMENT.
THREE OF THE FOUR WOMEN THAT MAKE UP THE SO-CALLED SQUAD.
HOW SIGNIFICANT IS THAT ESPECIALLY WHEN ELIZABETH WARREN WAS COURTING THAT ENDORSEMENT?
>> FIRST OF ALL IT MAKES TOTAL SENSE TO ME THAT BOTH SANDERS AND WARREN WERE COURTING THAT ENDORSEMENT BECAUSE THESE ARE THREE WOMEN WHO ARE VERY PROBLEM LARA MONK THE PROGRESSIVE WOMEN OF THE WATER, WHICH IS WHERE SANDERS AND WARREN ARE FIGHTING OUT THEIR CAMPAIGN, AND ARE VERY POPULAR AMONG YOUNGER DEMOCRATS, SO THESE ENDORSEMENTS ARE WORTH GETTING.
CERTAINLY WON'T HURT BERNIE, WILL PROBABLY HELP HIM A BIT, BUT WHETHER IT'S ENOUGH TO MOVE THE NEEDLE ON WHETHER HE CAN GET BACK IN THE MIX WITH BIDEN AND WARREN I THINK IS STILL TO SEE.
>> DARREN: LET'S TALK ABOUT HIS PERFORMANCE.
DID HE DO ENOUGH TO SHOW THE AMERICAN VOTER THAT HE IS FIT FOR THIS JOB?
>> RIGHT, WELL, I THINK IT WAS A START FOR SURE, HIM SHOWING UP, HE LOOKED GOOD, HE WAS STRONG, HE WAS CONFIDENT.
HE WAS IN MANY WAYS THE SAME OLD BERNIE SANDERS THAT WE'VE ALWAYS KNOWN.
SO THAT WAS GOOD.
BUT I DEFINITELY THINK THAT THIS IS GOING TO BE AN ISSUE THAT IS GOING TO CONTINUE TO FOLLOW HIM.
>> DARREN: BECAUSE HE KIND OF DODGED THE QUESTION ABOUT HIS HEALTH.
CAN HE CONTINUE TO DO THAT?
>> I THINK SO, AND I ALSO THINK THAT VERGE HE ALSO MIGHT NEED TO DEAL WITH HOW HE AND HIS CAMPAIGN RELEASED INFORMATION ABOUT HIS HEALTH IN THE HEAT OF WHAT WAS GOING ON.
>> DARREN: SO HE ACKNOWLEDGED DURING THE DEBATE THAT MEDICARE FOR ALL WILL IN FACT LIKELY RAISE TAXES ON THE MIDDLE CLASS.
ELIZABETH WARREN WOULD NOT GO THERE.
WHO DOES THIS HELP, WHO DOES THIS HURT?
>> YES, THAT'S REALLY HARD TO SUSS OUT.
IT MIGHT DEPEND ON WHETHER YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE NOMINATION OR GENERAL ELECTION.
I THINK IN THE ELECTION IF WARREN IS THE CANDIDATE SHE'S GOING TO HAVE TO ADDRESS THIS IN A WAY THAT CONVINCES THE AMERICAN PEOPLE THAT SHE'S BEING CANDID.
AND I THINK IT WAS INTERESTING THAT IN THE DEBATE THAT BERNIE SANDERS SORT OF HAD THE HEAT TAKEN OFF OF HIM ON THIS QUESTION BECAUSE HE HAS ACKNOWLEDGED, AS YOU HAVE SAID, THAT INFORMATION ABOUT MEDICARE FOR ALL AND TAXES.
>> DARREN: ANY STANDOUT MOMENTS, ANY BIG TAKE AWAYS FROM THIS DEBATE?
>> IN GENERAL OR WITH SENATOR SANDERS?
>> DARREN: IN GENERAL.
>> ON ONE LEVEL I THINK IN THESE DEBATES WE'RE BEGINNING TO SEE SORT OF THE SAME KIND OF THING, THE CANDIDATES WHO ARE NOT IN THE TOP TIER TRYING HARD TO GET INTO THE DEBATE, NOT GETTING AS MUCH ATTENTION.
ONE SORT OF STEADY TAKE AWAY FROM THE DEBATE WAS THAT ELIZABETH WARREN IS CLEARLY NOW, MAYBE ALONGSIDE JOE BIDEN THE FRONTRUNNER IN TERMS OF HOW MUCH TIME SHE WAS GIVEN AND HOW ALL THE OTHER CANDIDATES WERE BASICALLY COMING AFTER HER.
>> DARREN: WHO WON THE DEBATE?
>> OH, I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT.
I THINK IT MIGHT DEPEND ON WHO YOU SUPPORTED GOING INTO THE DEBATE.
I THINK ON ONE LEVEL BERNIE SANDERS DID TO SOME EXTENT, DID WHAT HE HAD TO DO.
MAYBE HE BENEFITED FROM THE LOWERED EXPECTATIONS OF HIM PARTICIPATING IN THIS DEBATE SO SOON AFTER THIS HEALTH CRISIS.
BUT ON THE OTHER HAND I THINK ELIZABETH WARREN DID A STEADY CONSISTENT JOB OF SENDING OFF THESE BARBS FROM THE OTHER CANDIDATES THAT CONSISTENTLY CAME AT HER.
>> DARREN: LISA HOLMES, THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.
>> DARREN: UP NEXT WE HITCH A RIDE WITH A PILOT AND DISCUSS HIS NEW BOOK THAT SOARS INTO TOPICS LIKE FLYING FEARS AND HOW THEY CAN CAUSE RELATIONSHIPS TO CRASH AND BURN.
>> DARREN: LESSONS LEARNED AT 4500 FEET.
A VERMONT NATIVE WHO HAS BEEN FLYING PLANES FOR 40 YEARS IS NOW A PUBLISHED AUTHOR.
WE SAT DOWN WITH ADAM ALPERT TO HEAR SOME OF THE STORIES THAT INSPIRED HIS BOOK, "WE HAVE NO CRASH POLICY."
>> ADAM, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.
>> MY PLEASURE.
>> THE NAME OF YOUR BOOK IS "WE HAVE A NO CRASH POLICY." TELL ME ABOUT THE BOOK.
>> THE BOOK IS LARGELY A MEMOIR.
THE STORIES THAT ARE CONTAINED WITHIN RELATE TO EXPERIENCES THAT I'VE HAD THROUGHOUT MY FLYING CAREER.
AND THROUGHOUT THE EXPERIENCES I'VE ENJOYED THROUGH AVIATION.
BUT ALSO STORIES ABOUT OTHER INTERESTING ASPECTS OF LIFE, RELATIONSHIPS, FOR EXAMPLE.
WHAT IT'S LIKE TO BE MARRIED TO A PILOT.
OR MARRIED TO SOMEBODY WHO IS AFRAID OF FLYING, OR PERHAPS JUST DATING SOMEBODY WHO IS AFRAID OF FLYING.
>> IN THE BOOK HE SHARES REAL LIFE LESSONS ABOUT WHAT DOES AND DOESN'T WORK IF YOU WANT TO KEEP RELATIONSHIPS GOING.
FOR EXAMPLE, HE LOST LORETTA AFTER TAKING HER ON A FLIGHT WHERE THE ENGINE CAUGHT FIRE.
>> ABOUT HALFWAY IN THIS CASE I WAS ABLE TO RETURN TO THE AIRPORT SAFELY, WITH THE HELP OF A RESCUE TEAM WHO EXTINGUISHED THE FIRE.
ALL WERE SAFE.
I WOULD CONSIDER THAT TO BE A SUCCESS.
>> BUT YOUR RELATIONSHIP BURNED TO THE GROUND?
>> YES.
THAT'S SADLY TRUE.
THAT WAS REALLY OUR LAST DATE.
IT DID UP MY, I THINK IT UPPED MY EMPATHY FOR PEOPLE WHO MAY BE APPREHENSIVE ABOUT FLYING, MAY BE OBJECTIVELY FEAR IT.
AND THE TITLE OF THE BOOK ACTUALLY STEMS FROM THAT IDEA.
IT SOUNDS MAYBE A LITTLE IMPROBABLE.
BUT WHEN I WOULD ENCOUNTER A PASSENGER THAT EXHIBITED SIGNS OF WORRY OR OUTRIGHT FEAR, I WOULD REMIND THEM THAT WE HAVE A NO-CRASH POLICY, AND SURPRISINGLY THEY WOULD RELAX.
MAYBE EVEN ENJOY THE FLIGHT TO SOME EXTENT.
AND SEEING THIS WORK ONCE CONVINCED ME THAT IT MAY BE REALLY SORT OF A PANACEA.
AND I HAVE FOUND THAT IF YOUR PASSENGER CHARGES BELIEVE YOU REALLY HAVE A NO-CRASH POLICY AND OBJECTIVELY I DO --
>> WHY WOULDN'T YOU?
>> THEY'RE MUCH MORE WILLING TO GO WITH YOU AND ACTUALLY MY EXPERIENCE IS THAT THEY TEND TO HAVE A PRETTY GOOD TIME.
>> HE REMEMBERED THAT EXPERIENCE AND LEARNED A FEW MORE LESSONS YEARS LATER ON A FLIGHT OVER THE CHAMPLAIN VALLEY WITH HIS WIFE.
>> ON THAT PARTICULAR DAY WE WERE OUT, I WOULD SAY, FOR A PLEASURE FLIGHT, IT STARTED OUT THAT WAY.
WITH THE PLAN TO MAKE A WATER LANDING.
UNFORTUNATELY WE HAD A MECHANICAL FAILURE OF THE HYDRAULIC SYSTEM RIGHT IN THE PROCESS OF CONDUCTING THAT LANDING, AND FORTUNATELY DETECT ED THE PROBLEM EARLY ENOUGH SO WE COULD ABORT, BUT IT PUT THE AIRCRAFT IN A VERY DANGEROUS SITUATION, WITH THE LANDING GEARS NOT QUITE RETRACTED AND NOT DEPLOYED EITHER.
SO WE SPENT A VERY LONG TIME TRYING TO ADDRESS THAT PROBLEM.
I USE WE HERE BECAUSE MY WIFE WAS WITH ME, AND IF EVER YOU WANTED TO TEST A RELATIONSHIP, SUBJECT YOUR SPOUSE TO AN EMERGENCY LANDING IN A 1944 VINTAGE WORLD WAR II AIRCRAFT.
>> HOW DID SHE REACT?
>> WELL, I WOULD GIVE HER VERY HIGH POINTS PERSONALLY.
NOW, SHE DID ATTEMPT TO CHANGE HER WILL, I'M NOT EXACTLY SURE HOW, BUT SHE WAS ON THE PHONE WITH SOMEBODY TALKING ABOUT ADDRESSING ESTATE PLANNING.
>> ON THE PLANE?
>> ON THE PLANE, WHILE I WAS TRYING TO SOLVE THIS PROBLEM.
BUT IN FAIRNESS TO HER, WE WORKED TOGETHER AS A TEAM AND ACTUALLY, TO HER CREDIT, IN ORDER FOR ME TO BE SUCCESSFUL RESOLVING THE PROBLEM, SHE ACTUALLY HAD TO FLY THE AIRPLANE FOR A TIME.
SO IF YOU'VE EVER EXPERIENCED THE CHALLENGE OF TEACHING YOUR SPOUSE SOMETHING, IMAGINE A PRESSURE COOKER ENVIRONMENT OF, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GOING TO DIE KIND OF, THAT TAKES IT UP A NOTCH.
BUT FOR GIESLA, IT WAS A VERY REASONABLE, I WOULD SAY, AND LOVING IN HER WILLINGNESS TO ACCEPT THE CHALLENGE, ACCEPT INSTRUCTION.
I THINK SHE HAD SOME SELF PRESERVATION THERE, TOO.
I'M NOT SURE IT CAME ACROSS AS LOVINGLY AS MAYBE IT IDEALLY SHOULD.
BUT WE WORKED TOGETHER AND ULTIMATELY WERE ABLE TO RESOLVE THE PROBLEM.
I'M HAPPY TO REPORT OUT SOULS WERE SAVED AND THE AIRCRAFT LIVES TO FLY ANOTHER DAY.
>> STILL MARRIED?
>> YES.
19 YEARS NOW.
>> CONGRATULATIONS.
THAT IS WONDERFUL.
BECAUSE THERE'S OFTEN MORE THAN ONE SIDE TO THE STORY, I ASKED HIS WIFE HER TAKE ON THE DAY.
>> IT WAS PRETTY DIRE AT THE TIME, WE DIDN'T KNOW IF WE WERE GOING TO MAKE IT OR NOT.
FOR HOURS HE TAUGHT ME HOW TO FLY, WHICH AS A BAND NEW, NEVER HAVING FLOWN A PLANE, THIS PLANE IS QUITE HEAVY, IT'S AN OLD WAR PLANE AND I DID MY BEST AND I KEPT IT UP AND HE WAS IN THE BACK TRYING TO HAMMER THE LANDING GEAR DOWN, AND IT TOOK US HOURS.
WE WERE GOING UP AND DOWN LAKE CHAMPLAIN, NOT KNOWING IF WE COULD GET IT TO COME DOWN.
BUT SEEING THAT WE HAVE A NO-CRASH POLICY, WE DID A GREAT JOB AND GOT US HOME SAFELY.
>> THE MOST IMPORTANT THING, SURPRISING IT TOOK ME AS LONG TO LEARN THIS, BUT HAVING RESPECT AND MUTUAL RESPECT, THE WAY YOU INTERACT WITH OTHER PEOPLE, EITHER IN YOUR CHARGE, COLLEAGUES, PEOPLE WHO ARE PERHAPS EVEN SUPERIOR TO YOU, IS A VERY INTERESTING INDICATOR OF SUCCESS OR FAILURE.
PEOPLE WHO HAVE AN INNATE EMOTIONAL INTELLIGENCE TEND TO BE BETTER PILOTS, TEND TO BE SAFER, AND I THINK ARE MORE SUCCESSFUL INDIVIDUALS JUST IN GENERAL.
THE ONLY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SORT OF THE REST OF LIFE AND FLYING IS FLYING TENDS TO POINT THIS OUT IN A MUCH MORE DRAMATIC AND SOMETIMES VIOLENT WAY, BECAUSE AIRPLANE ACCIDENTS THAT RESULT ARE TERRIBLE.
>> WHAT HAVE YOU LEARNED IN ALL THIS TIME IN TERMS OF RELATIONSHIPS?
>> WELL, I WOULD SAY --
IT'S A LITTLE OUT OF CONTEXT, BUT YOU KNOW FOR THOSE GUYS OUT THERE THAT ARE THINKING THE DAMSELS REALLY ARE LIVING TO BE RESCUED, THE TRUTH OF THE MATTER IS THEY DON'T WANT TO BE PUT IN DAMAGER IN THE FIRST PLACE.
SO MY ADVICE WAS TO BE TO DO WHATEVER YOU CAN TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU DON'T SUBJECT YOUR SPOUSE OR YOUR GIRLFRIEND OR ANYBODY ELSE THAT YOU'RE CLOSE TO, TO A DANGEROUS SITUATION.
BE PRO-ACTIVE TO AVOID THAT.
>> THAT'S A GREAT LESSON.
ANOTHER LESSON I'D LIKE TO ASK YOU ABOUT, HOW HARD WAS IT TO PUBLISH?
>> IF YOU REALLY WANT TO HAVE THE EXPERIENCE OF REJECTION, WRITE A BOOK AND TRY TO GET IT PUBLISHED.
BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY IT WAS LUCK THAT WON OUT.
>> HE KNEW A COUPLE OF VERMONT AUTHORS WHO HELPED HIM CRAFT A STRONG LETTER FOR PUBLISHERS AND SEEK OUT THE RIGHT ONE FOR HIS BOOK.
AFTER 45 REJECTIONS, ONE SAID YES.
>> IT WAS GOOD ENOUGH FOR PERSEVERANCE, AND ACTUALLY IF YOU LOOK AT IT IN TERMS OF THE SCOPE OF THE BOOK, ONE OF THE, I THINK, INTERESTING LESSONS IS THAT IT PAYS NOT TO GIVE UP.
AND IN FLYING THAT'S REALLY TRUE.
WHAT'S THE POINT, YOU MIGHT AS WELL KEEP FIGHTING THAT FIRE OR TRYING TO KEEP CONTROL OF THE AIRCRAFT.
IF YOU DON'T YOU KNOW YOU'RE GOING TO DIE OR HAVE SOMETHING TERRIBLE HAPPEN.
IF YOU KEEP FIGHTING, MAYBE YOU'LL SUCCEED, MAYBE YOU CAN SAVE THE DAY.
>> THANK YOU SO MUCH, ADAM.
>> MY PLEASURE.
>> DARREN: YOU CAN BUY THE BOOK ON AMAZON OR YOU CAN GO TO THE MILTON ARTIST GUILD ON ROUTE 7 IN MILTON, THERE YOU CAN ALSO SEE THE WORK OF THE ARTIST WHO CREATED THE ILLUSTRATIONS FOR THE BOOK.
THANK YOU FOR JOINING US, EVERYONE, HAVE A GREAT DAY.
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